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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by blenderboy5 View Post
    We'd actually prefer if you didn't ask that question. Because a logical answer could be "We'll end the war your stupid lying imperialist president started."

    But then it gets awkward because Barack Obama isn't going to end the Iraq war before at least 2010. At least. In fact I'd say not until 2012 when Democrats run on the "Ignore our platform they ****ed up Iraq" idea again.
    I tried to avoid using that sentence that I bolded!

    And I agree with the ending the Iraq was. IMO, 2010-2011 is about the time this war will end, hopefully.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by blenderboy5 View Post
    We'd actually prefer if you didn't ask that question. Because a logical answer could be "We'll end the war your stupid lying imperialist president started."

    But then it gets awkward because Barack Obama isn't going to end the Iraq war before at least 2010. At least. In fact I'd say not until 2012 when Democrats run on the "Ignore our platform they ****ed up Iraq" idea again.
    I have made this point before, and I think it is valid. If we are imperialist, why am I paying $4/gallon for gas when we just blew out an oil-rich country? If we are imperialist, isn't Iraq now the 51st state and shouldn't I be paying about $1.02/gal?

    Say what you want about the war and the reasons for it. We are the only country on Earth that does not keep the land we conquer, we give it back. Ask the French.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by PHX-SOXFAN View Post
    I love the regurgitated Rush talking points that have been addressed over and over but are still being touted as fact by the blowhards and spin machine clones. He gives specifics in his speeches, listen to more than the soundbites Rush plays. His site also has all of his policy stances and ideas. His site and many others also have legislative accomplishments. I can provide them if you need, just stop spouting lies and talking points that aren't true.
    You know, I have seen you post this "talking points" BS ad nauseum in this forum. I think you are just one big hypocrite. I have also seen this lame "you are just following Rush Limbaugh's talking points" argument in CNN, Fox News, the radio, other forums, and newspapers. So, I submit to you, and everyone else here, that, saying that we are just following right wing talking points, is in of itself a talking point.

    Besides, unless you are there in person to watch a George Bush press conference, and listen to a Hussein Obama speech in person, and watch in person as the Russians battle in Georgia, etc., then you are getting all your information 2nd hand, like the rest of us. And if humans are involved in that exchange of information, it's only human nature for them to inject their bias (just look at New York Times, CNN, MSNBC, websites, talk radio, and yes, Fox News). In essence, no matter where you get your news, you are getting talking points. We are all basing our opinions on, at least partly, talking points. So get off your high horse and stop pretending that only liberals have pure, original, opinions and that the rest of us are brainless droids who just repeat what we hear. I don't care where you get ideas or information, the fact that you have certain opinions is what matters.

    As for Obama's so called accomplishments, when Bush first ran for President, he would talk about what he did in Texas all the time. Same with Clinton and what he did in Arkansas. When does Obama publicly talk about what he did in Illinois (not a Governor of course, but as a State Senator) or what he has done in the two or three days that he has been in Washington? And yes, I'm sure it's in his website along with his, equally important, hobbies. I want to see in the debates how many times he references his political accomplishments (which should take about 5 seconds), and as I said before, "I opposed the war since the beginning" doesn't count as a political accomplishment.
    Last edited by Tragic Johnson; 08-21-2008 at 02:36 PM.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eastside Scott View Post
    I have made this point before, and I think it is valid. If we are imperialist, why am I paying $4/gallon for gas when we just blew out an oil-rich country? If we are imperialist, isn't Iraq now the 51st state and shouldn't I be paying about $1.02/gal?

    Say what you want about the war and the reasons for it. We are the only country on Earth that does not keep the land we conquer, we give it back. Ask the French.
    You forgot: Why aren't the Iraqi's Christians now?

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by yaowowrocket11 View Post
    Bush tax cuts for the wealthy over the past years has cost this nation over 2 trillion dollars. Bush increased the nation's debt by over 50%. By reversing the wealthy tax cuts, and stop the pointless government spending on student loan's, for example, our nation's situation would be better.
    This is great. Actual debate on issues. I hope people notice.

    Who is wealthy? What is the threshold?

    Could you please explain the student loans issue a little more, I do not know where you are coming from on that.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eastside Scott View Post
    I have made this point before, and I think it is valid. If we are imperialist, why am I paying $4/gallon for gas when we just blew out an oil-rich country? If we are imperialist, isn't Iraq now the 51st state and shouldn't I be paying about $1.02/gal?

    Say what you want about the war and the reasons for it. We are the only country on Earth that does not keep the land we conquer, we give it back. Ask the French.
    You're obviously not familiar with my posts. I was saying that's what the Left would say. I'm pretty conservative.
    "Compromise, hell! That's what has happened to us all down the line -- and that's the very cause of our woes. If freedom is right and tyranny is wrong, why should those who believe in freedom treat it as if it were a roll of bologna to be bartered a slice at a time?"

    RIP Jesse Helms

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by blenderboy5 View Post
    You're obviously not familiar with my posts. I was saying that's what the Left would say. I'm pretty conservative.
    Sorry about that. I have a hard time keping track. I use a lot of sarcasm in my posts, so I should be more watchful.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eastside Scott View Post
    This is great. Actual debate on issues. I hope people notice.

    Who is wealthy? What is the threshold?

    Could you please explain the student loans issue a little more, I do not know where you are coming from on that.
    In the past years, the government has spent lots of money in the student loan department, making more loans available, in private banks. If Obama reforms this student loan program, it can save taxpayers hundreds of dollars per year. This will even make college more affordable. Also, another good fact, the first bill Barack Obama introduced into Congress as a Senator dealt with the issue of enormous costs of expanding an education into a university or college.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eastside Scott View Post
    This is great. This is what I have been looking for. Honestly, this is the start point for a decent discussion. You ar the first person in the entire forum to break away from the "who he isn't" into the "who he is". I truly applaud you.

    Now, if I may continue the discussion...

    Could you please tell me who exactly is paying for all of this great stuff?
    actually we've gone over this and given examples to numerous people (most of whom are now banned for baiting) over the past six months. About every month or so someone comes in here to give the Limbaugh talking points everyday. I gave Obama's specifics several times. Let us know what additional information you would like. HE outlines his plans to pay for these items also on his website and in his speeches. You would have to do research and listen to speeches in their entirety instead of soundbites and talking points in order to gather this information. Obviously you're only interested in others doing your research in order to shut down the BS talking points you spew.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tragic Johnson View Post
    You know, I have seen you post this "talking points" BS ad nauseum in this forum. I think you are just one big hypocrite. I have also seen this lame "you are just following Rush Limbaugh's talking points" argument in CNN, Fox News, the radio, other forums, and newspapers. So, I submit to you, and everyone else here, that, saying that we are just following right wing talking points, is in of itself a talking point.

    Besides, unless you are there in person to watch a George Bush press conference, and listen to a Hussein Obama speech in person, and watch in person as the Russians battle in Georgia, etc., then you are getting all your information 2nd hand, like the rest of us. And if humans are involved in that exchange of information, it's only human nature for them to inject their bias (just look at New York Times, CNN, MSNBC, websites, talk radio, and yes, Fox News). In essence, no matter where you get your news, you are getting talking points. We are all basing our opinions on, at least partly, talking points. So get off your high horse and stop pretending that only liberals have pure, original, opinions and that the rest of us are brainless droids who just repeat what we hear. I don't care where you get ideas or information, the fact that you have certain opinions is what matters.

    As for Obama's so called accomplishments, when Bush first ran for President, he would talk about what he did in Texas all the time. Same with Clinton and what he did in Arkansas. When does Obama publicly talk about what he did in Illinois (not a Governor of course, but as a State Senator) or what he has done in the two or three days that he has been in Washington? And yes, I'm sure it's in his website along with his, equally important, hobbies. I want to see in the debates how many times he references his political accomplishments (which should take about 5 seconds), and as I said before, "I opposed the war since the beginning" doesn't count as a political accomplishment.
    I bring up the Limbaugh talking points because I listen to him for about 20 minutes a day and it is identical to yours and others' posts during a given week. Ironic? How about a proven pattern. I get my information from a wide variety of sources to avoid the overall spin and get all perspectives covered. That way I don't sound like an unoriginal blowhard by repeating some guy's exact opinions

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eastside Scott View Post
    This is great. Actual debate on issues. I hope people notice.

    Who is wealthy? What is the threshold?

    Could you please explain the student loans issue a little more, I do not know where you are coming from on that.
    Obama has detailed this threshold numerous times by now in debates and speeches. For someone who complains about his lack of policy, you don't have much info on what he has stated numerous times. Isn't that embarrassing to speak about something and be wrong only because you lack the information that is readily available to all of us?

  12. #72
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    Fivethirtyeight has Obama/McCain in a literal dead heat for popular vote (literally, 48.5 to 48.5), with McCain having a slight electoral college advantage.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by PHX-SOXFAN View Post
    actually we've gone over this and given examples to numerous people (most of whom are now banned for baiting) over the past six months. About every month or so someone comes in here to give the Limbaugh talking points everyday. I gave Obama's specifics several times. Let us know what additional information you would like. HE outlines his plans to pay for these items also on his website and in his speeches. You would have to do research and listen to speeches in their entirety instead of soundbites and talking points in order to gather this information. Obviously you're only interested in others doing your research in order to shut down the BS talking points you spew.
    at least he is being respectful... I would love to hear all this information too as a student that does not listen to Rush. To be honest I was actually supporting Obama at one point... until my best friend (who is a diehard Obama supporter) told me why she was voting for him.

    The PSD's Mack-Donald's Crew (formerly the Sheldon Richardson Crew) Members: Raidaz4life, raiderposting, HunterNRoss, N. Cog Neato, RaiderKid318, theGhost-isGone, NYRaiderLove, raiderizer, weeman323, RaJAxTWa, laek, Wolfe-Raider, Shred003, themadstork

  14. #74
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    Wait I have a quick question for those who study polls more than I do.

    Is Obama still doing better at the state level? I think the national polls have been close for quite some time, but it was my understanding that Obama still leads at polls conducted at a state level. Is this still the case?
    "Compromise, hell! That's what has happened to us all down the line -- and that's the very cause of our woes. If freedom is right and tyranny is wrong, why should those who believe in freedom treat it as if it were a roll of bologna to be bartered a slice at a time?"

    RIP Jesse Helms

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raidaz4Life View Post
    at least he is being respectful... I would love to hear all this information too as a student that does not listen to Rush. To be honest I was actually supporting Obama at one point... until my best friend (who is a diehard Obama supporter) told me why she was voting for him.
    and ... ? care to share?
    Когда́ де́ньги говоря́т, тогда́ пра́вда молчи́т

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