"I know how to win wars" - John McCain

[blenderboy5]

Yeah, it must be me.

I interpreted "his service did nothing to help our country" as degrading to McCain and veterans.

[gcoll]

umm. He's supported every bush move regarding Iraq, that's not very good, unless you consider hitting .300 good in the foreign policy department as well as on the diamond, but I doubt that's what you meant.

He has not supported every Bush move in Iraq.

He was actually a vocal critic. It put him at odds with the rest of the Republicans actually. He was calling for a new strategy, and more troops.

[J-E-T-S]

Kerry did fine while he served

I think it is the way he acted afterward that got people riled up a bit

Then again I don't know many veterans that have been involved in combat that think it is a good thing or want to go back and do it again.

It wasn't that that got them riled up, but when his wife said "shove-it" to the reporter. After that all hell broke loose! They said that saying it would cause him to loose the election and what-not. Heck it was all over FOX News!!

[papipapsmanny]

I hate how everyone thinks mccain has had so much military experience... doing what? being held in a military prison for most the war, im sure he got his experience there..

please my father has more experience in vitnam than mccain

[blenderboy5]

Yeah, McCain was a *****. What an idiot, letting them torture him like that. ****er, he should have done something like shout change a billion times. That's couragous.

[DenButsu]

I hate how everyone thinks mccain has had so much military experience... doing what? being held in a military prison for most the war, im sure he got his experience there..

please my father has more experience in vitnam than mccain

I really think it's unfair to discount McCain's service in Vietnam. He put his life on the line and suffered years of pain, torture and torment for his country. No reasonable person of any political persuasion should fail to recognize that.


But that said, the question of which column of his resume to file that experience under is a legitimate point of discussion, especially since McCain himself so frequently points to his Vietnam experience as a qualification.

And I've said basically the same thing before, but if you want to file that experience under "Character", fine I agree, or "Patriotism/Devotion to country", fine I agree, or even "Has some military experience in his background", sure, it's true, I'll accept that without reservations.

But when people - including McCain himself - basically use that to indicate it qualifies him as "Foreign policy expert", that's where I'd take exception and call that out as being fairly ridiculous. Which is, fwiw, exactly what Wesley Clark did, causing the media and the right to get their panties all in a bunch and ludicrously accuse him of "swiftboating McCain".

[ari1013]

The Iraqi PM put out a statement saying that he prefers Obama's Iraq plan. Guess all that "screaming change a billion times" is amounting to something.

[ink]

I really think it's unfair to discount McCain's service in Vietnam. He put his life on the line and suffered years of pain, torture and torment for his country. No reasonable person of any political persuasion should fail to recognize that.


But that said, the question of which column of his resume to file that experience under is a legitimate point of discussion, especially since McCain himself so frequently points to his Vietnam experience as a qualification.

And I've said basically the same thing before, but if you want to file that experience under "Character", fine I agree, or "Patriotism/Devotion to country", fine I agree, or even "Has some military experience in his background", sure, it's true, I'll accept that without reservations.

But when people - including McCain himself - basically use that to indicate it qualifies him as "Foreign policy expert", that's where I'd take exception and call that out as being fairly ridiculous. Which is, fwiw, exactly what Wesley Clark did, causing the media and the right to get their panties all in a bunch and ludicrously accuse him of "swiftboating McCain".

Excellent post.

[blenderboy5]

I really think it's unfair to discount McCain's service in Vietnam. He put his life on the line and suffered years of pain, torture and torment for his country. No reasonable person of any political persuasion should fail to recognize that.

And I've said basically the same thing before, but if you want to file that experience under "Character", fine I agree, or "Patriotism/Devotion to country", fine I agree, or even "Has some military experience in his background", sure, it's true, I'll accept that without reservations.

That sums up my beliefs as well.

And I'm really not trying to be a smart *** or look for incorrect spelling, but what does "fwiw" mean?

[ink]

That sums up my beliefs as well.

And I'm really not trying to be a smart *** or look for incorrect spelling, but what does "fwiw" mean?

for whatever it's worth?

[blenderboy5]

Ah thanks that makes sense. I'm just terrible at acronyms

[ari1013]

Ah thanks that makes sense. I'm just terrible at acronyms

hey, if you've never seen it before, then it's good you're asking about it.

[gcoll]

But when people - including McCain himself - basically use that to indicate it qualifies him as "Foreign policy expert", that's where I'd take exception and call that out as being fairly ridiculous. Which is, fwiw, exactly what Wesley Clark did, causing the media and the right to get their panties all in a bunch and ludicrously accuse him of "swiftboating McCain".

That'd be a fine explanation if Wesley Clark's comments were an isolated incident.

And it was more the phrasing. The "I don't think getting shot down in an airplane qualifies you to be president"...is probably the type of thing that got to people.