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View Poll Results: Brags for six man of the year

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39. You may not vote on this poll
  • love 2 c it but no

    30 76.92%
  • were giong to the final with the six man of the year

    9 23.08%
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Results 76 to 90 of 96

Thread: Bargs

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlakeyFool View Post
    He seemed like a good poster at the time..
    He was. He had pretty good handle on prospects. But sometimes people get overzealous about certain ones.

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by killersweet View Post
    B2B was all over him
    he had me so hyped for Jonas


  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by killersweet:32377039
    He was. He had pretty good handle on prospects. But sometimes people get overzealous about certain ones.
    Like MKG.
    “It’s about winning,” Stoudemire said. “You win, you’re going to get on national TV. Simple. In Phoenix, we won — Western Conference finals three, four years, playoffs every year. We won. If you don’t win, nobody really wants to see you.”

  4. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sadds The Gr8 View Post
    he had me so hyped for Jonas
    The NBA played a slower pace back then so he coulda fit bwtter. Guys like Hibbert and al Jeff were the best bigs during that time. Biggest problem with JV wouldnt jave been as apparent back then probably so it made him a more intriguing prospect.

  5. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps08-09 Champ View Post
    The NBA played a slower pace back then so he coulda fit bwtter. Guys like Hibbert and al Jeff were the best bigs during that time. Biggest problem with JV wouldnt jave been as apparent back then probably so it made him a more intriguing prospect.
    the way B2B explained it to us made it seem like his game would be suited better in today's game than 4-5 yrs ago. I expected an energy big that just rebounded and played defense. He was more skilled than I thought, but worse on defense than i thought.

    I thought we were getting more of a Chandler type but we got more of a Gortat type.


  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sadds The Gr8 View Post
    the way B2B explained it to us made it seem like his game would be suited better in today's game than 4-5 yrs ago. I expected an energy big that just rebounded and played defense. He was more skilled than I thought, but worse on defense than i thought.

    I thought we were getting more of a Chandler type but we got more of a Gortat type.
    He was pretty mobile when he came in. I was kinda hoping for those pau gasol comparisons to come through

  7. #82
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    That's because Raptors take the same stupid approach when developing their big men. Both Bargnani and Jonas were encouraged to put on weight after their rookie season. Problem is that the game was evolving and Raptors took a step backwards by making our bigs become less mobile. Bargnani gained 40 lbs over the summer after his rookie season, and Valanciunas gained 45 lbs over the summer after his rookie season. That is a lot of weight over a short span, where they should've gradually gained muscle and let their bodies adjust. When I was 155 lbs, I was able to dunk. Now I am 195 lbs and I can barely touch the rim.

    Jonas was suppose to be a Chandler type of motor with refined offense but that never panned out because they wanted him to be a traditional C. Those guys don't exist in starting lineups no more. It never made much sense to me, especially since Chandler is a skinny guy, why didn't they keep Valanciunas lean and mean? You would think they learn their mistakes after fattening up Bargnani on that primo pasta diet, and he became out of shape and was not able to hustle.

    I was a big Bargnani excuser and I was hoping they wouldn't do the same for Val but they did and it didn't make sense back then, it definitely doesn't make sense now.

  8. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Byronicle View Post
    That's because Raptors take the same stupid approach when developing their big men. Both Bargnani and Jonas were encouraged to put on weight after their rookie season. Problem is that the game was evolving and Raptors took a step backwards by making our bigs become less mobile. Bargnani gained 40 lbs over the summer after his rookie season, and Valanciunas gained 45 lbs over the summer after his rookie season. That is a lot of weight over a short span, where they should've gradually gained muscle and let their bodies adjust. When I was 155 lbs, I was able to dunk. Now I am 195 lbs and I can barely touch the rim.

    Jonas was suppose to be a Chandler type of motor with refined offense but that never panned out because they wanted him to be a traditional C. Those guys don't exist in starting lineups no more. It never made much sense to me, especially since Chandler is a skinny guy, why didn't they keep Valanciunas lean and mean? You would think they learn their mistakes after fattening up Bargnani on that primo pasta diet, and he became out of shape and was not able to hustle.

    I was a big Bargnani excuser and I was hoping they wouldn't do the same for Val but they did and it didn't make sense back then, it definitely doesn't make sense now.
    I agree so much I can't put it into words. This is exactly how I feel about both situations.

    Even more first rating because I don't see other teams doing the same. This seems like a raptors thing to get guys to put on a ton of weight and hope it develops into muscle.

  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Byronicle View Post
    That's because Raptors take the same stupid approach when developing their big men. Both Bargnani and Jonas were encouraged to put on weight after their rookie season. Problem is that the game was evolving and Raptors took a step backwards by making our bigs become less mobile. Bargnani gained 40 lbs over the summer after his rookie season, and Valanciunas gained 45 lbs over the summer after his rookie season. That is a lot of weight over a short span, where they should've gradually gained muscle and let their bodies adjust. When I was 155 lbs, I was able to dunk. Now I am 195 lbs and I can barely touch the rim.

    Jonas was suppose to be a Chandler type of motor with refined offense but that never panned out because they wanted him to be a traditional C. Those guys don't exist in starting lineups no more. It never made much sense to me, especially since Chandler is a skinny guy, why didn't they keep Valanciunas lean and mean? You would think they learn their mistakes after fattening up Bargnani on that primo pasta diet, and he became out of shape and was not able to hustle.

    I was a big Bargnani excuser and I was hoping they wouldn't do the same for Val but they did and it didn't make sense back then, it definitely doesn't make sense now.
    I don't mind that JV put in weight. We were trending getting smaller for a while but it accelerated only 3 years ago. Back in 2014, the Warriors were still running David Lee and Andrew Bogut in their starting lineup. Guys like Al Jeff and ZBo were (near) all stars. Players like Monroe and Pau was still playing PF, etc.

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps08-09 Champ View Post
    I don't mind that JV put in weight. We were trending getting smaller for a while but it accelerated only 3 years ago. Back in 2014, the Warriors were still running David Lee and Andrew Bogut in their starting lineup. Guys like Al Jeff and ZBo were (near) all stars. Players like Monroe and Pau was still playing PF, etc.
    One of Valanciunas strengths was high motor. Who has ever heard of a heavy high motor type of player? Its just a fact that the more weight you put on, the slower you get and that's because of inertia. Why slow down Valanciunas?

    And its how they got him to gain weight. That much weight over a couple of months is too drastic of a change for his body to adapt. They should've just let his body age and mature gradually over his career, not fatten him up.

    Even back then they had those guys like Pau playing as PF's in the beginning of the games, but they closed the games playing as the Center for their teams. Why? Because those large cumbersome C's who started the game don't have the endurance at the end and surprise surprise, Valanciunas doesn't play in the 4th for the same reasons. Pau plays better as a center and and played center for Memphis as well. Monroe is just a backup now, he can't play defense and did not amount to anything but Horford's backup. Speaking of Horford, look how that guy turned out, he even drains 3 balls and he was advertised as a PF coming in, but played and found success as a center his entire career.

  11. #86
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    Horford and Aldridge are good examples of skinny guys making it work.

    Also we all saw Val take a huge step this year defensively, closing out games, and offensively using his quickness. All of those things have to do with him cutting weight in the offseason.

    Seriously, when did putting on 30 lbs of weight in the offseason after your rookie year work? Can anyone name a player that this worked for? Dwight, LeBron, even pau or any of the success stories... They all added muscle mass over their first years. I seriously can't think of a time when this worked.

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Byronicle View Post
    One of Valanciunas strengths was high motor. Who has ever heard of a heavy high motor type of player? Its just a fact that the more weight you put on, the slower you get and that's because of inertia. Why slow down Valanciunas?

    And its how they got him to gain weight. That much weight over a couple of months is too drastic of a change for his body to adapt. They should've just let his body age and mature gradually over his career, not fatten him up.

    Even back then they had those guys like Pau playing as PF's in the beginning of the games, but they closed the games playing as the Center for their teams. Why? Because those large cumbersome C's who started the game don't have the endurance at the end and surprise surprise, Valanciunas doesn't play in the 4th for the same reasons. Pau plays better as a center and and played center for Memphis as well. Monroe is just a backup now, he can't play defense and did not amount to anything but Horford's backup. Speaking of Horford, look how that guy turned out, he even drains 3 balls and he was advertised as a PF coming in, but played and found success as a center his entire career.
    In that scenario, I was willing to trade his mobility in exchange for being a better suited offensive big man. His size now helps him operate inside. I was hoping that his 1 on 1 defense wouldn't have declined either, but clearly switching is the priority on defense now.

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raps08-09 Champ View Post
    In that scenario, I was willing to trade his mobility in exchange for being a better suited offensive big man. His size now helps him operate inside. I was hoping that his 1 on 1 defense wouldn't have declined either, but clearly switching is the priority on defense now.
    I would like that too, but you got a problem when Lowry and Derozan were playing the 2 man offense. Sure its better now, but it was ridiculous earlier and it wasn't evident until we briefly had James Johnson helping distribute the ball, followed up by Van Fleet and Wright joining our offense and we started going with 2 point guards to help distribute the ball.

    Then we signed Ibaka which meant less touches for Valanciunas, and we all know how that turned out.

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Byronicle View Post
    I would like that too, but you got a problem when Lowry and Derozan were playing the 2 man offense. Sure its better now, but it was ridiculous earlier and it wasn't evident until we briefly had James Johnson helping distribute the ball, followed up by Van Fleet and Wright joining our offense and we started going with 2 point guards to help distribute the ball.

    Then we signed Ibaka which meant less touches for Valanciunas, and we all know how that turned out.
    No way to predict that at the time. JV was like 22 and we lucked out on the playoff appearances. I assume they approached his early years with a rebuild but just didn't work that way and maybe they ended up having him focus on other things but his offense.

  15. #90
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    Seriously can anyone think of another franchise who does this to their big men? Gobert seems like a good example of a guy who would have been ruined here if he was told to put on a ton of pasta weight. I can't think of a single franchise who does this. I think it's time to look at some different trainers that understand the league.

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