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  1. #1
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    Is it time for blacks to abandon dems?

    It seems to me that neither republicans nor Dems take black voters serious. Republicans don't go to debates sponsored by black organizations because they don't expect to win that many black votes. They have also been accused by black republicans of largely ignoring the black community. It is because of this admission that many of those black Republicans are on the fence when it comes to who they will vote for.
    Then there is this phenomena with Hillary supporters who refuse to support Obama unless he either covers all of the 20 million dollars that Hillary lost while campaigning or adds her as his VP. If these supporters do stick to their guns on this threat and cost Obama the election what should black voters believe about this party?
    If Blacks were more flexible and intelligent when picking candidates would they be courted more and see more results from elected officials?
    In my opinion they would have more value and could get more of the results they have desired for generations. Your thoughts:

  2. #2
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    The Dems care about Blacks every November.

    Other than that, they demean their struggles by comparing it to gay rights. Or they support policy that keeps them impoverished. Or support programs like AA that hurt blacks. Or support policies that keep them relying on the government. Or don't do anything to bring back nuclear families into the community. Or help education.

    Yeah, it's about time.
    "Compromise, hell! That's what has happened to us all down the line -- and that's the very cause of our woes. If freedom is right and tyranny is wrong, why should those who believe in freedom treat it as if it were a roll of bologna to be bartered a slice at a time?"

    RIP Jesse Helms

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    yeah they should run and support the party that put's people like Brownie in position to help african americans in times of disaster.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blenderboy5 View Post
    The Dems care about Blacks every November.

    Other than that, they demean their struggles by comparing it to gay rights. Or they support policy that keeps them impoverished. Or support programs like AA that hurt blacks. Or support policies that keep them relying on the government. Or don't do anything to bring back nuclear families into the community. Or help education.

    Yeah, it's about time.
    You have GOT to be kidding me. IF they do compare their struggles to gay rights, how is that a demeaning comparison? How does AA hurt blacks? Did you not see Obama's Father's day speech where he called on all fathers, particularly black fathers, to take their familial responsibilities seriously? I mean, come on, you should submit your talking points to Fox News. There could be a career waiting for you.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bosox Believer View Post
    You have GOT to be kidding me. IF they do compare their struggles to gay rights, how is that a demeaning comparison? How does AA hurt blacks? Did you not see Obama's Father's day speech where he called on all fathers, particularly black fathers, to take their familial responsibilities seriously? I mean, come on, you should submit your talking points to Fox News. There could be a career waiting for you.
    Obama was absolutely right in calling out fathers the way he did but the point of that talk is for people to take accountability for their families and not rely on the gov't. I have nothing against the gay rights movement but the comparison for that movement and civil rights for blacks is minimal. Being gay isn't an issue until you tell people about your orientation. You can't hide race.
    For example gay men don't pay more for their cars than blacks, especially the women.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelican View Post
    It seems to me that neither republicans nor Dems take black voters serious. Republicans don't go to debates sponsored by black organizations because they don't expect to win that many black votes. They have also been accused by black republicans of largely ignoring the black community. It is because of this admission that many of those black Republicans are on the fence when it comes to who they will vote for.
    Then there is this phenomena with Hillary supporters who refuse to support Obama unless he either covers all of the 20 million dollars that Hillary lost while campaigning or adds her as his VP. If these supporters do stick to their guns on this threat and cost Obama the election what should black voters believe about this party?
    If Blacks were more flexible and intelligent when picking candidates would they be courted more and see more results from elected officials?
    In my opinion they would have more value and could get more of the results they have desired for generations. Your thoughts:
    1. Republicans used to get all of the Black votes. And then they started getting marginalized as Democrats began appealing to the Northeast. At that point, Republicans introduced their "Southern Strategy" and basically turned the party into a haven for Southern racists. It's part of the reason the GOP had such a success between 1968 and today. Unfortunately fpr them, they're about to be marginalized.

    2. Sure a few Clinton voters might go vote for McCain instead of Obama, but most polls show that's a tiny minority of Democrats. Bear in mind that Bush took 9% of the Dems in 2004 -- and McCain's got about 12-14% currently in polls. Part of that could be because McCain's still being perceived as a maverick, and not because of a Hillary effect.

    3. Obama can't pay off Clinton's debts. The most he can give is $2,300 just like any other American.

    4. Calling Blacks unintelligent for voting for the Democrats is a pretty naive blanket statement -- especially now. Obama, more than any other politician, can give hope to the Black community in this country and start motivating more Blacks, Hispanics, and other minorities to take control of their own destiny. The days of the Sharptons and Jacksons is coming to an end. Conservatives should be loving this, since Obama's calling for the same thing they've been saying for years now.
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pelican View Post
    Obama was absolutely right in calling out fathers the way he did but the point of that talk is for people to take accountability for their families and not rely on the gov't. I have nothing against the gay rights movement but the comparison for that movement and civil rights for blacks is minimal. Being gay isn't an issue until you tell people about your orientation. You can't hide race.
    For example gay men don't pay more for their cars than blacks, especially the women.
    The relevance of your example eludes me.
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by ari1013 View Post
    The relevance of your example eludes me.
    yeah i you're right

  9. #9
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    Obama was absolutely right in calling out fathers the way he did but the point of that talk is for people to take accountability for their families and not rely on the gov't.
    Yeah. But a lot of his policy positions don't reflect that stance.

    Like that new commercial of his. He talks, like he's a conservative to try and win over some of the demographics that aren't voting for him.

    Conservatives should be loving this, since Obama's calling for the same thing they've been saying for years now.
    Except he's not labeled as a racist for it.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bosox Believer View Post
    You have GOT to be kidding me. IF they do compare their struggles to gay rights, how is that a demeaning comparison?
    Seriously?

    Tell me again how going from property to being free is similar to being allowed to marry. Explain to me how the freedom of being able to walk around town without being lynched (though in fairness that does happen in the gay community) is similar to not being allowed to have two parent adoption. Explain to me how the right to eat in the general area of whites is the same as being allowed to accessorize freely.

    How does AA hurt blacks?
    It says "you're not talented enough to get this job/college spot/opportunity, so here's a hand out.

    To the other employees who have the job or lost out on the job, it says "we like all our employees equally. We just love some more equally than others."

    And worse, it says to the individual "Did I really deserve this job? Or was this just a handout by PC liberals who feel bad?"

    Did you not see Obama's Father's day speech where he called on all fathers, particularly black fathers, to take their familial responsibilities seriously?
    Yeah, I saw it. I'm not a sheep so I wasn't that inspired. In all fairness, I'm also not a black father.

    But the right's been saying this **** for years. How the nuclear family is the best way to raise a family. How father figures are important. How black families need more stability, less welfare, and no reparations. Now in Obama's defense it took you guys a decade and a half plus to realize hillary's a *****.

    So for Obama to get up there and in empty rhetoric try to garner some votes on the most opportunitistic holiday was meaningless. Will he actually change policies? It'll be nice if he does. But doubtful. Not even just because he's Obama, or a democrat, or a politician. But you can't change a culture easily. And the system is against fathers anyway (divorce is incredibly anti-male, so is child support, men don't have a say in the birth if accidental pregnancy occurs especially fiscally, etc).
    Last edited by blenderboy5; 06-20-2008 at 01:22 AM.
    "Compromise, hell! That's what has happened to us all down the line -- and that's the very cause of our woes. If freedom is right and tyranny is wrong, why should those who believe in freedom treat it as if it were a roll of bologna to be bartered a slice at a time?"

    RIP Jesse Helms

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by blenderboy5 View Post
    Seriously?

    Tell me again how going from property to being free is similar to being allowed to marry. Explain to me how the freedom of being able to walk around town without being lynched (though in fairness that does happen in the gay community) is similar to not being allowed to have two parent adoption. Explain to me how the right to eat in the general area of whites is the same as being allowed to accessorize freely.



    It says "you're not talented enough to get this job/college spot/opportunity, so here's a hand out.

    To the other employees who have the job or lost out on the job, it says "we like all our employees equally. We just love some more equally than others."

    And worse, it says to the individual "Did I really deserve this job? Or was this just a handout by PC liberals who feel bad?"



    Yeah, I saw it. I'm not a sheep so I wasn't that inspired. In all fairness, I'm also not a black father.

    But the right's been saying this **** for years. How the nuclear family is the best way to raise a family. How father figures are important. How black families need more stability, less welfare, and no reparations. Now in Obama's defense it took you guys a decade and a half plus to realize hillary's a *****.

    So for Obama to get up there and in empty rhetoric try to garner some votes on the most opportunitistic holiday was meaningless. Will he actually change policies? It'll be nice if he does. But doubtful. Not even just because he's Obama, or a democrat, or a politician. But you can't change a culture easily. And the system is against fathers anyway (divorce is incredibly anti-male, so is child support, men don't have a say in the birth if accidental pregnancy occurs especially fiscally, etc).


    Ironically Obama's black father abandoned him.


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  12. #12
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    And the system is against fathers anyway (divorce is incredibly anti-male, so is child support, men don't have a say in the birth if accidental pregnancy occurs especially fiscally, etc).
    Support male abortion rights!!!

    I'm gonna start a petition.

  13. #13
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    Apparently a lot of black Republicans are doing just the opposite - or in some cases, at least thinking about it.

    Black conservatives conflicted on Obama campaign

    By FREDERIC J. FROMMER, Associated Press WriterSat Jun 14, 7:18 PM ET

    Black conservative talk show host Armstrong Williams has never voted for a Democrat for president. That could change this year with Barack Obama as the Democratic Party's nominee.

    "I don't necessarily like his policies; I don't like much that he advocates, but for the first time in my life, history thrusts me to really seriously think about it," Williams said. "I can honestly say I have no idea who I'm going to pull that lever for in November. And to me, that's incredible."

    Just as Obama has touched black Democratic voters, he has engendered conflicting emotions among black Republicans. They revel over the possibility of a black president but wrestle with the thought that the Illinois senator doesn't sit beside them ideologically.

    "Among black conservatives," Williams said, "they tell me privately, it would be very hard to vote against him in November."

    Perhaps sensing the possibility of such a shift, Republican presidential candidate John McCain has made some efforts to lure black voters. He recently told Essence magazine that he would attend the NAACP's annual convention next month, and he noted that he recently traveled to Selma, Ala., scene of seminal voting rights protests in the 1960s, and "talked about the need to include 'forgotten Americans.'"

    Still, the Arizona senator has a tall order in winning black votes, no doubt made taller by running against a black opponent. In 2004, blacks chose Democrat John Kerry over President Bush by an 88 percent to 11 percent margin, according to exit polls.

    J.C. Watts, a former Oklahoma congressman who once was part of the GOP House leadership, said he's thinking of voting for Obama. Watts said he's still a Republican, but he criticizes his party for neglecting the black community. Black Republicans, he said, have to concede that while they might not agree with Democrats on issues, at least that party reaches out to them.

    "And Obama highlights that even more," Watts said, adding that he expects Obama to take on issues such as poverty and urban policy. "Republicans often seem indifferent to those things."

    Likewise, retired Gen. Colin Powell, who became the country's first black secretary of state under President George W. Bush, said both candidates are qualified and that he will not necessarily vote for the Republican.

    "I will vote for the individual I think that brings the best set of tools to the problems of 21st-century America and the 21st-century world regardless of party, regardless of anything else other than the most qualified candidate," Powell said Thursday in Vancouver in comments reported by The Globe and Mail in Toronto.

    Writer and actor Joseph C. Phillips got so excited about Obama earlier this year that he started calling himself an "Obamacan" — Obama Republican. Phillips, who appeared on "The Cosby Show" as Denise Huxtable's husband, Navy Lt. Martin Kendall, said he has wavered since, but he is still thinking about voting for Obama.

    "I am wondering if this is the time where we get over the hump, where an Obama victory will finally, at long last, move us beyond some of the old conversations about race," Phillips said. "That possibly, just possibly, this great country can finally be forgiven for its original sin, or find some absolution."

    Yet Phillips, author of the book "He Talk Like a White Boy," realizes the irony of voting for a candidate based on race to get beyond race.

    "We have to not judge him based on his race, but on his desirability as a political candidate," he said. "And based on that, I have a lot of disagreements with him on a lot of issues. I go back and forth."

    Michael Steele, the Republican former lieutenant governor of Maryland who lost a Senate race there in 2006, said he is proud of Obama as a black man, but that "come November, I will do everything in my power to defeat him." Electing Obama, he said, would not automatically solve the woes of the black community.

    "I think people who try to put this sort of messianic mantle on Barack's nomination are a little bit misguided," he said.

    John McWhorter, a self-described political moderate who is a senior fellow at the conservative Manhattan Institute and a New York Sun columnist, said Obama's Democratic Party victory "proves that while there still is some racism in the United States, there is not enough to matter in any serious manner. This is a watershed moment."

    "Obama is probably more to the left than I would prefer on a lot of issues," he adds. "But this issue of getting past race for real is such a wedge issue for me. And he is so intelligent, and I think he would be a perfectly competent president, that I'm for him. I want him to get in because, in a way, it will put me out of a job."
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  14. #14
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    Am I racist if I vote for McCain because he's white?

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by brandonwarne52 View Post
    Am I racist if I vote for McCain because he's white?
    Do you have a confederate flag hanging out your window?

    Why do people have a problem because people are voting for Obama because he is black? Is it wrong to be proud because you can be a part of history in the making?

    I am an Obama supporter and I support him on many of his stands.. does him being black also sway my decision.. Um.. Yeah it does... because if a Black man can become president of the United States of America, then this is a big step forward for all.. Latinos, Jews, Asians, and everyone who is proud to call themselves an American.

    We all have our reasons on why we choose the canidate that we want as President..

    Alot of people voted for Bush the 2nd time around because they felt they should go with the Devil they know than the Devil they don't know (Kerry)..

    I voted for Gore the first time around and as a victim of 911 I voted for Bush the 2nd time around.. Because he sold me on the whole we are going after the 911 Terrorists... (damn I feel stupid now)

    Some may vote because of issues, some people vote because of religion, race, and other options sway a person's decision on the candidate.

    Some may even vote because they like his wife better than McCains. Does it make them wrong? Maybe in some people's eyes but not all. It is on the individual to decide why they want this candidate, regardless of the reason behind it.

    How many men you think voted for Obama, for the simple fact that they don't want to see a woman as president..
    Last edited by Apophis; 06-20-2008 at 11:46 AM. Reason: spell check

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