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View Full Version : Prince Fielder to the Giants?



xander
09-17-2008, 05:23 PM
I recently read in the San Francisco Chronicle that the Giants would be a possible destination for Fielder. What would the Brewers want in return? Lincecum is untouchable, and Cain is pretty close to untouchable.

gottaHaveHart
09-17-2008, 06:29 PM
probably take one of them at least...

xander
09-17-2008, 06:40 PM
What about Cain for Fielder and Hardy?

Brooke
09-17-2008, 06:44 PM
I would gladly give up Fielder but not Hardy

brewersfan729
09-17-2008, 07:00 PM
What about Cain for Fielder and Hardy?

You wish. If we're giving you Fielder and Hardy we better be getting Cain and Bumgarner.

redwings1
09-17-2008, 07:04 PM
yeah i really wouldnt give up both Fielder and Hardy

gottaHaveHart
09-17-2008, 07:39 PM
i dont know if fielder is worth cain by himself, let alone with hardy

gottaHaveHart
09-17-2008, 07:49 PM
wow peter gammons mentioned cain for fielder and hardy and another player would be a possibility but i highly doubt that...

Brooke
09-17-2008, 07:54 PM
^^ Fielder I dont care BUT Hardy I have a big problem with them trading him and I know a lot of people will be very ticked off if he is traded

OC Knights #11
09-17-2008, 08:46 PM
umm ya i would be really pissed if they got rid of hardy for just cain. Cain for Fielder, is a better deal for the giants, cain isn't all that special. Another manny parra.

Mr.Chi-Town
09-18-2008, 11:53 AM
umm ya i would be really pissed if they got rid of hardy for just cain. Cain for Fielder, is a better deal for the giants, cain isn't all that special. Another manny parra.

maybe add a mid lvl prospect and i think its fair because fielder will be making an impact every game and cain only every 5. plus fielder has proven himself to where cain has the potential to be an ace.

gottaHaveHart
09-18-2008, 12:03 PM
fielder has proven he can't put a team and his back

Brew Crew
09-18-2008, 12:25 PM
Of course he gets hot now, when everyone is annyoed. I'd like to know where this has been the whole season. We saw tiny streaks of it, but not the Prince of 07'. Maybe he can carry us now and EARN his big arbitration salary that he's going to get.

Brooke
09-18-2008, 12:31 PM
Fielder gets hot sometimes then there are times he is just cold. I will say these past couple of games he has put the team on his back. He kept them in the game the other night, too bad he choked at the end

gottaHaveHart
09-18-2008, 01:13 PM
yeah he diff should have done something with that pitch

Mr.Chi-Town
09-18-2008, 04:05 PM
he prob thought it was gonna be a fastball thats all wood threw him b4 that pitch.

OnWisconsin2007
09-18-2008, 04:35 PM
Are you guys seriously ragging on Prince for that backward K to end the first game? You guys are idiots if you think any player in the majors would have hit that. Babe Ruth in his prime wouldn't have hit that, in that situation. You guys do realize it's the first breaking pitch he threw for a strike all night, right?

PackCrewBuckBad
09-18-2008, 04:47 PM
I guarentee some players in the majors could have hit it...even in that situation

OnWisconsin2007
09-18-2008, 04:49 PM
I guarentee some players in the majors could have hit it...even in that situation

I guarantee not. He didn't throw a single breaking pitch for a strike the entire inning, didn't throw Princey a single one, and what looked like a high fastball drops 10 inches for a strike. Not a chance.

OC Knights #11
09-18-2008, 05:26 PM
maybe add a mid lvl prospect and i think its fair because fielder will be making an impact every game and cain only every 5. plus fielder has proven himself to where cain has the potential to be an ace.

That still is a rip off for us. Fielder can hit 50 home runs. Cain will give you maybe 9 wins. -another Manny Parra. Great!....not. Lincecum is what i want

xander
09-18-2008, 06:08 PM
That still is a rip off for us. Fielder can hit 50 home runs. Cain will give you maybe 9 wins. -another Manny Parra. Great!....not. Lincecum is what i want

Cain is an ace on almost every other team beside the Giants and a few others. He has nine wins because the bullpen has blown about five, and the offense has given him one run or less about four times.

AmazinMets
09-18-2008, 06:31 PM
Cain is an ace on almost every other team beside the Giants and a few others. He has nine wins because the bullpen has blown about five, and the offense has given him one run or less about four times.An ace on almost every team? An ace on the Mets Phillies Brewers Cubs Reds Dodgers Padres Astros D Backs Angels Mariners Indians Rays Red Sox and Blue Jays?

OC Knights #11
09-18-2008, 10:54 PM
Cain is an ace on almost every other team beside the Giants and a few others. He has nine wins because the bullpen has blown about five, and the offense has given him one run or less about four times.

still don't care, the brewers need a number 1 starter. Cain is not a number 1. Maybe a 3 or 4. Linecum is what i want.

CubsGirl
09-19-2008, 12:42 AM
still don't care, the brewers need a number 1 starter. Cain is not a number 1. Maybe a 3 or 4. Linecum is what i want.
He's a solid 2, and he's all you'd get for Fielder.

And, on the other hand, it would be silly to give Fielder up for that.

brewersfan729
09-19-2008, 12:58 AM
And, on the other hand, it would be silly to give Fielder up for that.

I wouldn't mind giving up Fielder for Cain. I wouldn't be ecstatic about it, but I wouldn't hate it.

Fielder and Hardy for Cain like what was suggested earlier in the thread however is an absolute joke of a deal for the Brewers.

CubsGirl
09-19-2008, 01:09 AM
I was gonna say take Taschner and Valez but Velez is Weeks without power and half the errors.
HAHA, I thought you said Trachsel. I was going to campaign for your de-TMing.

cali72888
09-19-2008, 01:37 PM
cain is one of the best pitchers in baseball, how can you say he is a 3 or 4 starter?
yes he would be a #1 on the mets, rays, sox, phillies.....any team. with run support he could be the best pitcher in baseball, but with us he is no more then a average pitcher because we give him 0 runs.

Hardy and Fielder for cain is not a dream trade, its very possible. hardy and fielder will be owed alot of money next season, cain around 2 million. you can resign cc with the money you save if you wanted, or get a great 1b like texiera.

with the way your team implodes i would look for anything other then whats on the team now. fielder will not be on the brews in Two season reguardless so why not trade him now and get what you can for him.

o yea and hardy is not that good.

AmazinMets
09-19-2008, 01:41 PM
cain is one of the best pitchers in baseball, how can you say he is a 3 or 4 starter?
yes he would be a #1 on the mets, rays, sox, phillies.....any team. with run support he could be the best pitcher in baseball, but with us he is no more then a average pitcher because we give him 0 runs.

Hardy and Fielder for cain is not a dream trade, its very possible. hardy and fielder will be owed alot of money next season, cain around 2 million. you can resign cc with the money you save if you wanted, or get a great 1b like texiera.

with the way your team implodes i would look for anything other then whats on the team now. fielder will not be on the brews in Two season reguardless so why not trade him now and get what you can for him.

o yea and hardy is not that good.Wow I didn't know Cain would be a number 1 over Mark Buehrle Cole Hamels Scott Kazmir Josh Beckett and JOHAN SANTANA.

Brooke
09-19-2008, 01:47 PM
cain is one of the best pitchers in baseball, how can you say he is a 3 or 4 starter?
yes he would be a #1 on the mets, rays, sox, phillies.....any team. with run support he could be the best pitcher in baseball, but with us he is no more then a average pitcher because we give him 0 runs.

Hardy and Fielder for cain is not a dream trade, its very possible. hardy and fielder will be owed alot of money next season, cain around 2 million. you can resign cc with the money you save if you wanted, or get a great 1b like texiera.

with the way your team implodes i would look for anything other then whats on the team now. fielder will not be on the brews in Two season reguardless so why not trade him now and get what you can for him.

o yea and hardy is not that good.

so he is a #1 over Josh Beckett, Johan Santana, Kazmir, Hamels???

as for JJ, he is better than some think he is. I would gladly give up Fielder, JJ not so much

Cub_StuckinSTL
09-19-2008, 01:48 PM
Dont the giants have that Travis Ishikawa? Last I heard he was destroying the ball in AAA

brewersfan729
09-19-2008, 04:37 PM
Hardy and Fielder for cain is not a dream trade, its very possible.

Look, I'm not going to destroy your dream as a Giants fan. Oh wait, yes I am. There is no chance that trade is happening. We're giving away two above average contributors for one and the one we're getting back only helps us 30 times a season.

giantspwn
09-19-2008, 04:46 PM
This trade makes no sense. Fielder doe's not fit in with this team. We already have 3-4 1B's that I would rather have play over Fielder. Cain is worth way more than just Fielder. Besides, his fat arse would have a super low OBP and only hit 25 in our park if he's lucky..

Cain for Hardy makes more sense, I think a trade can be worked around these 2.

Cain's value is much higher than some think. He's shown at times he can be just as dominate as Timmy. Although, he's been inconsistent this year, he's only 23 years old and I imagine Matt still has better potential than any pitcher in your organization especially Parra or Gallardo. LOL

giantspwn
09-19-2008, 04:49 PM
Dont the giants have that Travis Ishikawa? Last I heard he was destroying the ball in AAA

Yah, he's got a good OBP, good pop, and he plays great defense at first. We also have Pablo Sandoval who is killing the ball ever since being called up, as well as Angel Villalona, who's one of most touted prospects.

jtrinaldi
09-19-2008, 04:59 PM
Notice how only people who like the trade are the people who came over from the giants board to post on here:mad:

giantspwn
09-19-2008, 05:02 PM
Notice how only people who like the trade are the people who came over from the giants board to post on here:mad:

I don't like the trade idea and I'm a Giants fan. :confused:

giantspwn
09-19-2008, 06:16 PM
We may be in the heat of the pennant races, but the Giants' hot stove talk appears to be on fire.

A lingering rumor was given new life Wednesday night. ESPN's Peter Gammons said the Giants could trade starting pitcher Matt Cain, 23, to the Brewers for first baseman Prince Fielder, 24, shortstop J.J. Hardy, 26, and another player. He didn't cite his source.

First, I would make this deal in a heartbeat. Cain (15-29 the last two seasons) has yet to fulfill his potential. Fielder (80 homers and 212 RBIs in that time) is a legitimate left-handed slugger. And Hardy (314 hits) would be an offensive upgrade for aging Omar Vizquel.

Whether you agree with me or not, I'm not Giants general manager Brian Sabean. He has shunned overtures to deal Cain or Cy Young nominee Tim Lincecum.

Sabean has said he sees keeping Cain, Lincecum and Barry Zito together for some time. And if Zito has turned it around, Sabean could have his own version of Tom Glavine, Greg Maddux and John Smoltz.

That takes patience. Lincecum has blossomed, and Cain hasn't.

If you are going to rebuild the Giants along with the kids coming from the minors this would be the deal to kick-start them.

Sacbee.com

hahahaha :laugh:

brentn2n
09-19-2008, 06:29 PM
as a giants fan .... the trade would work out great for both... unles u watch cain over lik 10-20 starts then u wont understand wat he can do, lik most pitchers cain will hav a nite where one or 3 or even 3 pitches isnt working for him but then theres nights win he has everythin n looks lik timmy, hes 23 n is no less than a #2 pitcher

xander
09-19-2008, 06:46 PM
Don't blame me when Fielder gains an extra 15 pounds and drops an extra 15 points on his average, while you guys finally realize that Hardy is a very average player but Cain gets an ERA below 3.20 and wins 15 games.

Laudy
09-19-2008, 11:36 PM
umm ya i would be really pissed if they got rid of hardy for just cain. Cain for Fielder, is a better deal for the giants, cain isn't all that special. Another manny parra.

OK, just wanted to make sure I read this right.... I live in wis, love the crew.... but did you just compare Matt Cain to Manny Parra???

OC Knights #11
09-19-2008, 11:40 PM
OK, just wanted to make sure I read this right.... I live in wis, love the crew.... but did you just compare Matt Cain to Manny Parra???

Similar to the fact that they both are up and comeing and both are struggling.

OC Knights #11
09-19-2008, 11:42 PM
I would slit my wrists if we traded Fielder (50 HR) Hardy (Gold Glove Defense, 26 HR) for the piece of **** giants pitcher, Matt Cain 8-13. He hasn't even proven anything yet, but somehow people think this is a good trade???

Hmm....2 proven players for 1 not proven player???? Thats a toughy, no deal!

But hey if you brewer fans want to take a step in the wrong direction, and be like 5 years away from the playoffs, then your an idiot.

xander
09-20-2008, 12:26 AM
Is all you guys look at is record? Wow, Cain is 8-13 so he must suck, right? I'm not suggesting that this trade would actually happen, just think before you say stupid things.

cali72888
09-20-2008, 12:47 AM
Cains numbers vs your so called best pitchers (beckett,Kazmir, Santana, Hamels)

W ERA K's WHIP

Cain: 8-13 3.91 176 1.35

Beckett: 12-9 3.96 166 1.18 Better ERA and K's....about the same....
cain= 1 for 1

Kazmir: 11-7 3.50 153 1.27 More K's, not much difference between the two.
cain=2 for 2

Hamels: 14-9 3.10 189 1.08 has cain beat in every catagory cain= 2for3

Santana: 14-7 2.65 187 1.17 Beats cain in all catagorys....2 for 4.

so cain beats out two of your 4 so called best pitchers.........please explain how can cain be average??

and cain is at least one year younger then all of the above pitchers.
who is to say next season cain will not be better then all of them?

the only reason cain is inconsistant is because his team is putting up 1 run a game. if santana was on a team that bad he would be a little inconsistant also. Give cain 4-5 runs a game and i 100% guarantee you he would win 15+

brewersfan729
09-20-2008, 12:49 AM
Don't blame me when Fielder gains an extra 15 pounds and drops an extra 15 points on his average, while you guys finally realize that Hardy is a very average player but Cain gets an ERA below 3.20 and wins 15 games.

Ahahaha. You're no better than the guy who says Cain sucks.

Again, we're trading nearly 60 homers from our offense, our only left handed hitter and one of our best right handed hitters for a pitcher. Yeah, that's never happening. I'd much rather go through a 80 win season with Fielder and Hardy next year and then have Gallardo, Parra, Jeffress, Anundsen, Periard etc. as a rotation.

This trade sets us way back with no upgrade at all for next year.

cali72888
09-20-2008, 12:50 AM
and cain is making 1 mill next season compared to 15 million you will have to pay between hardy and fielder next season. could inable you to resign cc or sheets.......
who would be your ace if cc and sheets left??

brewersfan729
09-20-2008, 12:51 AM
Cains numbers vs your so called best pitchers (beckett,Kazmir, Santana, Hamels)

W ERA K's WHIP

Cain: 8-13 3.91 176 1.35

Beckett: 12-9 3.96 166 1.18 Better ERA and K's....about the same....
cain= 1 for 1

Kazmir: 11-7 3.50 153 1.27 More K's, not much difference between the two.
cain=2 for 2

Hamels: 14-9 3.10 189 1.08 has cain beat in every catagory cain= 2for3

Santana: 14-7 2.65 187 1.17 Beats cain in all catagorys....2 for 4.

so cain beats out two of your 4 so called best pitchers.........please explain how can cain be average??

and cain is at least one year younger then all of the above pitchers.
who is to say next season cain will not be better then all of them?

the only reason cain is inconsistant is because his team is putting up 1 run a game. if santana was on a team that bad he would be a little inconsistant also. Give cain 4-5 runs a game and i 100% guarantee you he would win 15+

Cain pitches in the NL in one of the most pitcher friendly parks in the league. Santana has pitched in the AL all but one year, Hamels pitches in a bandbox, Beckett and Kazmir pitch in the AL.

cali72888
09-20-2008, 12:52 AM
no way in hell you would win 80 games between the rotation brewersfan just mentioned

brewersfan729
09-20-2008, 12:55 AM
and cain is making 1 mill next season compared to 15 million you will have to pay between hardy and fielder next season. could inable you to resign cc or sheets.......
who would be your ace if cc and sheets left??

Yovani Gallardo. Maybe you've heard of him. And I'd much rather pay Fielder and Hardy $15 million. They'll contribute much more than Cain will.

Honestly, which starting rotation and lineup would you rather have?

We make the trade:

Weeks
Escobar
Braun
Nelson
Hart
Cameron
Branyan/Hall
Kendall

Gallardo
Cain
Parra
Suppan
Bush

We don't make the trade:

Weeks
Hardy
Braun
Fielder
Hart
Cameron
Branyan/Hall
Kendall

Gallardo
Parra
Bush
Suppan
Villanueva

I'll take not making the trade easily.

brewersfan729
09-20-2008, 12:56 AM
no way in hell you would win 80 games between the rotation brewersfan just mentioned

Yes we would. 80 at the most. We're adding a good pitcher but getting rid of two above average offensive contributors. That's a downgrade.

MontanatoClark
09-20-2008, 01:26 AM
Here is one Giants fan who does not want Fielder. A trade surrounding Hardy and a prospect is a much more promising idea. The Brewers have a great SS prospect coming up and they need to clear salary to make a run at CC or Sheets. I think they will trade Fielder, I just hope the Giants are not stupid enough to offer Cain for him. Fielder stinks at first and his melt down in the dugout won't endear him to teammates, plus he is a DH.

If the Brewers can trade Fielder and Hardy and keep one of their front end starters, they could actually improve. Gamel and Escobar are great young prospects. I am not as high on Parra, Gallardo and Jeffries though. So keeping either Sheets or CC is the key for next year for the Brewers. You guys have a great future if you can keep your rotation in tact.

CAIN=FUTURE
09-20-2008, 01:55 AM
Fielder is overwieght, and destined to be a dh. He will not produce at AT&T. He is not Barry Bonds.

brewersfan729
09-20-2008, 02:33 AM
He will not produce at AT&T. He is not Barry Bonds.

1. How do you know he won't produce? Short right field porch, left handed slugger. Seems like a perfect fit, no?

2. Who said he was Barry Bonds?

Brooke
09-20-2008, 07:14 AM
Cains numbers vs your so called best pitchers (beckett,Kazmir, Santana, Hamels)

W ERA K's WHIP

Cain: 8-13 3.91 176 1.35

Beckett: 12-9 3.96 166 1.18 Better ERA and K's....about the same....
cain= 1 for 1

Kazmir: 11-7 3.50 153 1.27 More K's, not much difference between the two.
cain=2 for 2

Hamels: 14-9 3.10 189 1.08 has cain beat in every catagory cain= 2for3

Santana: 14-7 2.65 187 1.17 Beats cain in all catagorys....2 for 4.

so cain beats out two of your 4 so called best pitchers.........please explain how can cain be average??

and cain is at least one year younger then all of the above pitchers.
who is to say next season cain will not be better then all of them?

the only reason cain is inconsistant is because his team is putting up 1 run a game. if santana was on a team that bad he would be a little inconsistant also. Give cain 4-5 runs a game and i 100% guarantee you he would win 15+


Cain has a long way to go to even be in the same sentence as them so please just stop already. Santana has some games when the BP has blown it for him, same with Josh Beckett(that and him being injured twice this season has made him inconsistent but he looks to be back to his dominant self.) If you give me a choice bwtn any one of them or Cain, I pick them in a heartbeat

when he has accomplished as much as they have, then maybe he can put in the same sentence as them

once again some dont realize how good JJ is and how important he is to this team. Losing their best defender, their most consistent hitter, no thanks. There is a reason JJ is hitting behind Prince

Laudy
09-20-2008, 08:37 AM
Cain has a long way to go to even be in the same sentence as them so please just stop already. Santana has some games when the BP has blown it for him, same with Josh Beckett(that and him being injured twice this season has made him inconsistent but he looks to be back to his dominant self.) If you give me a choice bwtn any one of them or Cain, I pick them in a heartbeat

when he has accomplished as much as they have, then maybe he can put in the same sentence as them

once again some dont realize how good JJ is and how important he is to this team. Losing their best defender, their most consistent hitter, no thanks. There is a reason JJ is hitting behind Prince

Sure there is, it's because Cory Hart cant get his bat anywhere near a pitch right now and the Crew finally had the sense to get Weeks out of the lineup

thawv
09-20-2008, 09:02 AM
Ahahaha. You're no better than the guy who says Cain sucks.

Again, we're trading nearly 60 homers from our offense, our only left handed hitter and one of our best right handed hitters for a pitcher. Yeah, that's never happening. I'd much rather go through a 80 win season with Fielder and Hardy next year and then have Gallardo, Parra, Jeffress, Anundsen, Periard etc. as a rotation.

This trade sets us way back with no upgrade at all for next year.

I am a Cubs fan who follows the Brewers because they're a nice young team and I have a great friend who is a die hard Crew fan from Wisconsin. That being said, to make that deal would be crazy!

You guys are going to lose CC and Sheets at the end of the year. Gallardo should go right to the top of the rotation, followed by Parra. The rest needs some work. By acquiring a couple of starters for Fat and JJ is completely moving backwards. You already have two front line pitchers right now.................AND you have Fat and JJ. Picking up two new front line pitchers for Fat and JJ is the same as GIVING them away. You still have the two pitchers, just different names on their backs. Now you don't have Fat and JJ.

If you do trade Fat, then Mat Gamel better learn how to play first, because LaPorta is gone. Keep JJ at short and send Escobar to play winter ball at second base. That's his best chance to make the club. The kid's a stud. He needs to be up here. Besides, he can't be any worse than Weeks.

If Gamel improves a ton defensively at third, that would be great for the Crew. Bring him up! Gamel, JJ, Escobar and Fat. Now that is a young infield with a ton of talent for the next ten years. You now need to address center field and catching. (age) Pitching is going to be a real problem unless the checkbook gets opened up. Because there is no one in the farm system that can step into the rotation.

Sorry to see the collapse that is happening this month. Get back on track and lets meet in the playoffs.

Tom

Brooke
09-20-2008, 10:24 AM
Sure there is, it's because Cory Hart cant get his bat anywhere near a pitch right now and the Crew finally had the sense to get Weeks out of the lineup


I am with you on Weeks but JJ is one of their best hitters and a RBI guy, they should have done this a while ago. I just think it is dumb to trade JJ. I know as of right now he is the one I trust most at the plate right now(I know Prince is hot but he goes so back and forth). I normally trust Braun first but he is struggling bad right now

I think behind Braun he is the best player on the team

Laudy
09-20-2008, 10:53 AM
Yovani Gallardo. Maybe you've heard of him. And I'd much rather pay Fielder and Hardy $15 million. They'll contribute much more than Cain will.

Honestly, which starting rotation and lineup would you rather have?

We make the trade:

Weeks
Escobar
Braun
Nelson
Hart
Cameron
Branyan/Hall
Kendall

Gallardo
Cain
Parra
Suppan
Bush

We don't make the trade:

Weeks
Hardy
Braun
Fielder
Hart
Cameron
Branyan/Hall
Kendall

Gallardo
Parra
Bush
Suppan
Villanueva

I'll take not making the trade easily.


Not sure how I feel about this.... This is making the asumption that the team makes no other moves to improve if it makes the deal.

Brew Crew
09-20-2008, 10:56 AM
Well getting Alcides Escobar up to play SS will almost automatically get Hall or Weeks out of the line-up for good. That is, if they don't trade Hardy which, unless they find a great deal, shouldn't do just yet. He is streaky, but his streaks are long ones that definetely can carry a team.

AmazinMets
09-20-2008, 12:11 PM
Cains numbers vs your so called best pitchers (beckett,Kazmir, Santana, Hamels)

W ERA K's WHIP

Cain: 8-13 3.91 176 1.35

Beckett: 12-9 3.96 166 1.18 Better ERA and K's....about the same....
cain= 1 for 1

Kazmir: 11-7 3.50 153 1.27 More K's, not much difference between the two.
cain=2 for 2

Hamels: 14-9 3.10 189 1.08 has cain beat in every catagory cain= 2for3

Santana: 14-7 2.65 187 1.17 Beats cain in all catagorys....2 for 4.

so cain beats out two of your 4 so called best pitchers.........please explain how can cain be average??

and cain is at least one year younger then all of the above pitchers.
who is to say next season cain will not be better then all of them?

the only reason cain is inconsistant is because his team is putting up 1 run a game. if santana was on a team that bad he would be a little inconsistant also. Give cain 4-5 runs a game and i 100% guarantee you he would win 15+Santana would easily have 18 plus wins if it wasn't for the bullpen and lack of run support earlier in the year. Both Kazmir and Beckett were hurt this year so I can see them having a bounce back year. And how does Cain beat out Kazmir when Kazmirs ERA is a half point lower and his whip is 8 points lower? Kazmirs ERA jumped after his last start aganist the Red Sox...

OC Knights #11
09-20-2008, 12:25 PM
Fielder is overwieght, and destined to be a dh. He will not produce at AT&T. He is not Barry Bonds.

just give him steriods. San Fran is good for that. This trade is so stupid. San Fran would be walking away with everything.

xander
09-20-2008, 12:29 PM
Yovani Gallardo. Maybe you've heard of him. And I'd much rather pay Fielder and Hardy $15 million. They'll contribute much more than Cain will.

Honestly, which starting rotation and lineup would you rather have?

We make the trade:

Weeks
Escobar
Braun
Nelson
Hart
Cameron
Branyan/Hall
Kendall

Gallardo
Cain
Parra
Suppan
Bush

We don't make the trade:

Weeks
Hardy
Braun
Fielder
Hart
Cameron
Branyan/Hall
Kendall

Gallardo
Parra
Bush
Suppan
Villanueva

I'll take not making the trade easily.

No. The Brewers wouldn't trade Hardy and Fielder straight up for Cain, they would probably get a stud young hitter in return. If the Brewers got catcher Pablo Sandoval (hit about .350 with 20 HRs in minors, has hit about .333 in about 1.5 months in the majors) it would be worth their while. Plus you forgot to add Matt Gamel and Escobar. So here we go:

Brewers with trade:
SS Escobar
RF Hart
1B Gamel
LF Braun
C Sandoval
CF Cameron
3B Branyon/ Hall
2B Weeks

Rotation:
1. Sabathia or Sheets (Hardy + Fielder is 15 million, which would help you be able to sign one of the two)
2. Cain
3. Gallardo
4. Parra
5. Suppan


Brewers without the trade:
Weeks
Hardy
Braun
Fielder
Hart
Cameron
Branyan/Hall
Kendall

1. Gallardo
2. Parra
3. Bush
4. Suppan
5. Villanueva



So basically you could have Parra as a #4 starter rather than a #2, plus, you can open up spots for Gamel and Escobar that were blocked by Fielder and Hardy.

Brew Crew
09-20-2008, 02:07 PM
Brewers with trade:
SS Escobar
RF Hart
1B Gamel
LF Braun
C Sandoval
CF Cameron
3B Branyon/ Hall
2B Weeks

you can open up spots for Gamel and Escobar that were blocked by Fielder and Hardy.

Hardy is going to be blocked out by Alcides Escobar. Atleast that's what the plan seems to be. And who said Gamel is going to be playing at 1B? Brad Nelson would get his fair shot at the position if Fielder was traded away.

Last time I heard, the Brewers saved their great catching prospect in Angel Salome at the trade deadline and also picked Brett Lawrie in the draft. I don't think the Brewers are looking for another catcher. Especially since Kendall could be starting next year as well for some time.

zookerman182
09-20-2008, 07:16 PM
I have been reading this forum for a week or so and i decided to register because i live in huntsville (about 5 minutes from the AA stadium) and i have good insight on our prospects.

Escobar will be the starting SS when the season starts next year and we will find something to do with Hardy in the off-season. Salome will also at some point next season be our catcher. He has turned himself into a major league hitter this year and just needs some experience calling games. Gamel is ready for the lineup but not quite ready for the field. Depending on how much of our offense we trade away will probably determine how long he stays in the bigs next season. Either way i think with Escobar, Salome, and Gamel all waiting in the wings we should have an amazing young team in the next few years.

This is without even mentioning Cain and Brantley who can both hit and field and are young also.

I am sick like the rest of the brewers fans on here who witnessed this terrible collapse so the only thing that keeps me going at this point is the potential of our farm system.

brewersfan729
09-20-2008, 07:28 PM
Salome will also at some point next season be our catcher.

There is a 0% chance of this happening.

zookerman182
09-20-2008, 07:34 PM
yeah your right, a .246 avg with 2 hr through 143 games is what we need next season. Salome got called up for a reason, to get a feel for big league baseball. Angel is the Brewers catcher of the future.

kanersen
09-20-2008, 07:54 PM
blue jays fan here
i know the state of pitching is at a premium right now
but this 'proposed trade' would be high state robbery
i honestly wouldn't even trade fielder for cain in what they have accomplished so far respectively in their careers
let alone fielder and hardy (+ a prospect?)

brewersfan729
09-20-2008, 08:30 PM
yeah your right, a .246 avg with 2 hr through 143 games is what we need next season. Salome got called up for a reason, to get a feel for big league baseball. Angel is the Brewers catcher of the future.

Kendall is signed through next year and is a very good defender. Salome still has problems with defense. They're going to have him at AAA next year and he'll be the starter in 2010.

Giannis94
09-20-2008, 08:32 PM
No. The Brewers wouldn't trade Hardy and Fielder straight up for Cain, they would probably get a stud young hitter in return. If the Brewers got catcher Pablo Sandoval (hit about .350 with 20 HRs in minors, has hit about .333 in about 1.5 months in the majors) it would be worth their while. Plus you forgot to add Matt Gamel and Escobar. So here we go:

Brewers with trade:
SS Escobar
RF Hart
1B Gamel
LF Braun
C Sandoval
CF Cameron
3B Branyon/ Hall
2B Weeks

Rotation:
1. Sabathia or Sheets (Hardy + Fielder is 15 million, which would help you be able to sign one of the two)
2. Cain
3. Gallardo
4. Parra
5. Suppan


Brewers without the trade:
Weeks
Hardy
Braun
Fielder
Hart
Cameron
Branyan/Hall
Kendall

1. Gallardo
2. Parra
3. Bush
4. Suppan
5. Villanueva



So basically you could have Parra as a #4 starter rather than a #2, plus, you can open up spots for Gamel and Escobar that were blocked by Fielder and Hardy.

1 WORD SALOME

jtrinaldi
09-20-2008, 08:36 PM
giants fans this is the brewer board please talk about it over there on you board your becoming a nuissance "in my opinion" over here . We are brewer fans and most of us think the trade shouldnt be done so with all respect could you just stay in the giants board.



Gammons said that there is a better chance of Hart being traded than fielder BTW

zookerman182
09-20-2008, 08:45 PM
Kendall is signed through next year and is a very good defender. Salome still has problems with defense. They're going to have him at AAA next year and he'll be the starter in 2010.

Dont get me wrong, defense is very important especially where catcher is concerned but to possibly have a .285 15 hr young catcher on our hands and not put him to use is crazy. Take a season and get him used to playing. I agree Kendal is great at calling games and playing D but his bat is one of the worst in baseball.

brewersfan729
09-20-2008, 09:07 PM
Dont get me wrong, defense is very important especially where catcher is concerned but to possibly have a .285 15 hr young catcher on our hands and not put him to use is crazy. Take a season and get him used to playing. I agree Kendal is great at calling games and playing D but his bat is one of the worst in baseball.

He's signed through next year, they're not going to bench him, Salome still needs to work on his defense, that's what the minors are for. Put two and two together there. Salome is going to the minors.

Smithy04
09-21-2008, 08:16 PM
I actually heard the J.J. Hardy and a minor league player or two would be the ones being traded to the San Francisco Giants for their SP Matt Cain, not Prince Fielder.

Brooke
09-21-2008, 09:50 PM
I still dont like JJ being traded, just move him to 2nd or 3rd, Rickie and Hall are pretty useless most of the time

brewersfan729
09-21-2008, 09:51 PM
Gammons is saying Prince, JJ and a minor leaguer for Cain. Thats getting raped if you ask me.

Did you expect anything less from those morons at ESPN? Gammons is senile.

xander
09-21-2008, 09:51 PM
I actually heard the J.J. Hardy and a minor league player or two would be the ones being traded to the San Francisco Giants for their SP Matt Cain, not Prince Fielder.

JJ and Matt Gamel? :D

OnWisconsin2007
09-22-2008, 12:12 AM
Is Cain really that good? We need to cut away dead weight like Hall, Weeks, Cameron, Gagne, not trade away JJ and keep the likes of Weeks or Hall.

BaRRySandAmaN
09-22-2008, 01:21 PM
We will see what happens but in no way would I trade JJ and Prince for Matt Cain. Thats highway robbery for the Giants, Cain is a good pitcher but not worth 2 all star caliber players.

Smithy04
09-22-2008, 05:41 PM
I'd trade J.J. and a minor leaguer for Cain, but not Prince.

Smithy04
09-22-2008, 05:41 PM
Escobar should be able to step ion nicely even though I do like J.J., but I think Prince is a bigger asset to our team and especially with Escobar coming up.

Brooke
09-22-2008, 06:49 PM
I would trade Prince over JJ in a heartbeat but that is just my opinion

mise
09-22-2008, 07:01 PM
Besides 2 consecutive years of 200 innings+, comparable ERA / WHIP / SO numbers to top flight #1 and #2 starters around the league, here's why Matt Cain will get more than just JJ Hardy or Prince Fielder Straight up :

Contract Information for Matt Cain

03/07: Signed four-year, $9 million extension w/2011 club option ($1 million signing bonus). 2008: $700,000, 2009: $2.65 million, 2010: $4.25 million, 2011: $6.25 million club option, 2012: Free Agent

He's signed for the next 3 years at an average of 4 million a year. Hardy / Fielder each will make much more than that in arbitration in 2010 and 2011.

Matt Cain is only 24, is signed for the next 3 years at bargain basement prices, and although his walk number has not gone down as much as I liked, his Strike Out number has picked up.

Here's a very good read if you want to get to know Matt Cain and his mechanics a little bit.

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/bringin-some-serious-cheese-matt-cain/

brewersfan729
09-22-2008, 07:21 PM
Besides 2 consecutive years of 200 innings+, comparable ERA / WHIP / SO numbers to top flight #1 and #2 starters around the league, here's why Matt Cain will get more than just JJ Hardy or Prince Fielder Straight up :

Contract Information for Matt Cain

03/07: Signed four-year, $9 million extension w/2011 club option ($1 million signing bonus). 2008: $700,000, 2009: $2.65 million, 2010: $4.25 million, 2011: $6.25 million club option, 2012: Free Agent

He's signed for the next 3 years at an average of 4 million a year. Hardy / Fielder each will make much more than that in arbitration in 2010 and 2011.

Matt Cain is only 24, is signed for the next 3 years at bargain basement prices, and although his walk number has not gone down as much as I liked, his Strike Out number has picked up.

Here's a very good read if you want to get to know Matt Cain and his mechanics a little bit.

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/bringin-some-serious-cheese-matt-cain/

He may be worth more indivudually but Hardy and Fielder for Cain is a joke of a trade for the Brewers. Absolutely horrible.

OC Knights #11
09-22-2008, 08:55 PM
Escobar should be able to step ion nicely even though I do like J.J., but I think Prince is a bigger asset to our team and especially with Escobar coming up.

I disagree. Prince brings homeruns thats about it, we don't need hr, we need guys who can hit runners in scoring postion, without having to rely on the hr. JJ is better at that and his defense is better.

Cain isn't all that good.

OnWisconsin2007
09-22-2008, 08:59 PM
I just don't get why everybody thinks that Cain is that good. He numbers are terrible.

Brewersin08
09-22-2008, 10:12 PM
Trade Fielder to the Giants for Sanchez and Wilson. Gamel takes over next year at 1B, and if he sucks for some reason, play Rivera there. Frank Thomas is also available to my knowledge if things really go to hell. Trade Weeks, Hall, Suppan, Riske to Baltimore for Brian Roberts. Weeks is a young 2B with some potential, and Baltimore needs a Shortstop. Hall has shown he can play short and he may have a bounce back year. Suppan is a decent 4 or 5 starter and Riske pretty much sucks. Durham signs elsewhere. Escobar starts at SS, and Hardy moves to 3B. Branyan or Lamb sign to be the back up 3B, and the Brewers resign Counsell for another year. Braun stays put in Left. Brewers sign Kotsay or let Gwynn play CF. Cameron is just too expensive, although he does bring 20+ homers. Hart stays in RF. Kapler resigns to be the 4th outfielder. Sign Sabathia ideally, but more realsitically either Sheets or Burnett. Sign Coffey, Mota, Shouse, and let Gagne go gone-yay.
Rotation:
1. Sheets/Burnett/Sabathia???
2. Gallardo
3. Sanchez
4. Parra
5. Bush

Bullpen:
1. Wilson CL
2. Torres SU
3. Mota SU
4. Coffey MR
5. Shouse MR
6. Villanueva MR/LR
7. Capuano or McClung LR

Lineup:
1. Roberts 2B
2. Escobar SS
3. Braun LF
4. Gamel 1B
5. Hart RF
6. Hardy 3B
7. Kotsay CF
8. Kendall C

Bench:
Branyan 3B
Kapler OF
Lamb IF
Counsell? Someone Else?

brewersfan729
09-22-2008, 10:49 PM
Trade Fielder to the Giants for Sanchez and Wilson. Gamel takes over next year at 1B, and if he sucks for some reason, play Rivera there. Frank Thomas is also available to my knowledge if things really go to hell. Trade Weeks, Hall, Suppan, Riske to Baltimore for Brian Roberts. Weeks is a young 2B with some potential, and Baltimore needs a Shortstop. Hall has shown he can play short and he may have a bounce back year. Suppan is a decent 4 or 5 starter and Riske pretty much sucks. Durham signs elsewhere. Escobar starts at SS, and Hardy moves to 3B. Branyan or Lamb sign to be the back up 3B, and the Brewers resign Counsell for another year. Braun stays put in Left. Brewers sign Kotsay or let Gwynn play CF. Cameron is just too expensive, although he does bring 20+ homers. Hart stays in RF. Kapler resigns to be the 4th outfielder. Sign Sabathia ideally, but more realsitically either Sheets or Burnett. Sign Coffey, Mota, Shouse, and let Gagne go gone-yay.
Rotation:
1. Sheets/Burnett/Sabathia???
2. Gallardo
3. Sanchez
4. Parra
5. Bush

Bullpen:
1. Wilson CL
2. Torres SU
3. Mota SU
4. Coffey MR
5. Shouse MR
6. Villanueva MR/LR
7. Capuano or McClung LR

Lineup:
1. Roberts 2B
2. Escobar SS
3. Braun LF
4. Gamel 1B
5. Hart RF
6. Hardy 3B
7. Kotsay CF
8. Kendall C

Bench:
Branyan 3B
Kapler OF
Lamb IF
Counsell? Someone Else?

You honestly have no idea how unrealistic this whole thing is. It was pretty much a waste of time.

Brewersin08
09-22-2008, 10:57 PM
I was thinking that was a video game move. Trading Weeks, Hall, Suppan, Riske all for Roberts seems like the Brewers are getting the raw end of that. If anything we better get Sherril too if we're sending that much.

If Baltimore would take Weeks, Hall, Suppan and Riske for Roberts we are getting the better end of the deal. 3 expendable dead weight contracts and an underachieving 2B for Roberts would be a great trade for Milwaukee. If we could get Sherill too it would be a plus.

Brewersin08
09-22-2008, 10:59 PM
You honestly have no idea how unrealistic this whole thing is. It was pretty much a waste of time.

You seriously never contribute anything around here. All you do is wait for someone to actually post an idea, and then you rip it up. I don't see whats unrealistic about it. Fielder for Wilson and Sanchez would be a realistic deal. I could have said Fielder for Lincecum, but that isn't gonna happen. Those four guys for Roberts is also realistic.

Laudy
09-22-2008, 11:09 PM
I just don't get why everybody thinks that Cain is that good. He numbers are terrible.

Best response I can think of..... uh what???????

I gotta hear your supporting evidence on this one....

Brewersin08
09-22-2008, 11:18 PM
Thats the only thing you said there thats any bit close to reality. First of all the Brewers get a really short end of the stick and the Orioles get a boost in their payroll I don't think would help them so the trade would never happen. When was the last time 4 major leaguers got traded for 1?

Sexson for Overbay, Counsell, Capuano, Moeller, and some other scrubs. It's not likely, but just an idea. I don't think they would give us Roberts and Sherill for those four. I don't see how we get the short end of the stick. All four of those guys suck, and Weeks especially needs a change of scenery. If anything Baltimore is getting massively raped. Not the Brewers.

brewersfan729
09-22-2008, 11:49 PM
All four of those guys suck, and Weeks especially needs a change of scenery.

Now you're getting it! Why would Baltimore trade someone productive for $20+ million in contracts that will make them worse? They won't.

rzrk18
09-23-2008, 01:29 AM
I said all I want to about this trade in the Giants forum but to the guy who called Hardy a "very average player"...You're just a flat out moron.

giantspwn
09-23-2008, 04:31 AM
You seriously never contribute anything around here. All you do is wait for someone to actually post an idea, and then you rip it up. I don't see whats unrealistic about it. Fielder for Wilson and Sanchez would be a realistic deal. I could have said Fielder for Lincecum, but that isn't gonna happen. Those four guys for Roberts is also realistic.

The Giants have one of the worst bull pens in the league. I doubt we trade the only good part of it away. That being said, Wilson and Sanchez are to much for Fielder. The Giants strength is Starting Pitching, and thats what they are willing to give up for a Big bat not bull pen arms.

Wilson and Sanchez> Fielder

A Legit 40 SV closer + a #2 or 3 starter>>>>>>slightly above average first basemen that will command a bunch of money..

This would be a more reasonable trade IMO:
Johnathon Sanchez and Henry Sosa (RHP prospect) for JJ Hardy

kanersen
09-23-2008, 10:10 AM
ive never seen a perennial 30 hr 100 rbi man so undervalued in my life
if i had fielder on my jays team i'd keep him at all costs
and if i were to trade him, i'd certainly want more then just matt cain

brewersfan729
09-23-2008, 03:24 PM
I doubt we trade the only good part of it away.

Wilson isn't even good. He has a 4.33 ERA and 1.41 WHIP. Saves are a worthless stat.


Wilson and Sanchez> Fielder

Yeah, you go ahead and keep your 4.33 ERA closer and 4.71 ERA starting pitcher.


A Legit 40 SV closer + a #2 or 3 starter

On what planet is Sanchez a 2 or 3 starter?


This would be a more reasonable trade IMO:
Johnathon Sanchez and Henry Sosa (RHP prospect) for JJ Hardy

You wish.

chicagofan71
09-23-2008, 03:53 PM
Sexson for Overbay, Counsell, Capuano, Moeller, and some other scrubs. It's not likely, but just an idea. I don't think they would give us Roberts and Sherill for those four. I don't see how we get the short end of the stick. All four of those guys suck, and Weeks especially needs a change of scenery. If anything Baltimore is getting massively raped. Not the Brewers.

Why the **** would the O's do that? If they wanted **** for Roberts, the Cubs would already have him for Marquis, Cedeno, Pie and Eyre

CAIN=FUTURE
09-23-2008, 05:59 PM
Trade Fielder to the Giants for Sanchez and Wilson.

:laugh:

No way in hell the Giants trade him. Hes gonna be a stud closer. Hes like the only reliable arm in are bullpen.

:laugh2:

There's no way you get him.

....Brewersfan729, how exactly are saves worthless? They're kind of the whole thing you need a closer to do.

brewersfan729
09-23-2008, 06:17 PM
....Brewersfan729, how exactly are saves worthless? They're kind of the whole thing you need a closer to do.

Yeah, it's really difficult for a reliever to come in with a 1, 2 or 3 run lead in the 9th and get three outs. Most relievers could do it. You're going to have about a 95% chance of winning if you make it to the 9th with a lead so put any decent reliever in and he'll get a ton of saves. That's why I'm going to laugh when someone hands out an insane contract to Francisco Rodriguez this offseason when he's not even the best reliever on his own team.

CAIN=FUTURE
09-23-2008, 08:46 PM
Yeah, it's really difficult for a reliever to come in with a 1, 2 or 3 run lead in the 9th and get three outs. Most relievers could do it. You're going to have about a 95% chance of winning if you make it to the 9th with a lead so put any decent reliever in and he'll get a ton of saves. That's why I'm going to laugh when someone hands out an insane contract to Francisco Rodriguez this offseason when he's not even the best reliever on his own team.

Ok....your completely wrong. There's a mentality to being a closer. I think there's a reason managers just put any pitcher out to pitch the 9th. There's a reason the Mets bullpen has fallen apart with the loss of Billy Wagner. If you recall, before he went down the Mets bullpen was doing great. When he went down, so did the rest of the bullpen. I think that managers have formated the bullpen the way they do for a reason.

jtrinaldi
09-23-2008, 09:00 PM
Ur just trying to prove you point to try to get prince easier but when it comes to the real world prinice wont be easy to get.

Giants fans this is the brewer forums please with all respect could you go to the giants forum i think were all getting annoyed by you.
Mods not trying to piss anyone off but if u find it offensive it is not intended to be but i asked them nicely once and they are still here

brewersfan729
09-23-2008, 10:31 PM
Ok....your completely wrong. There's a mentality to being a closer.

No there isn't. Our closer was regarded as a decent to good middle reliever who couldn't handle pressure situations. Well, he's done a fine job as a closer since taking over for Gagne.

[/QUOTE]I think there's a reason managers just put any pitcher out to pitch the 9th.[/QUOTE]

Because most managers are morons who are slaves to meaningless statistics.


There's a reason the Mets bullpen has fallen apart with the loss of Billy Wagner.

Yeah, it's really pretty simple to figure out. Whenever any team loses their best reliever, their bullpen is going to suffer.

Think about it this way. It's the 7th inning. Your team is leading 4-2, the bases are loaded with one out. Would you rather bring in your "closer" (normally your best reliever) or one of your middle relievers who isn't as good as your "closer?" I'd rather bring in my best reliever in the biggest spot, no matter when that spot occurs and then let one of my other relievers, who is likely worse come into the game with a clean slate in the 8th and 9th inning.

rzrk18
09-23-2008, 10:35 PM
What is it with Giants fans and overusing the word "Average"? First they call Hardy "very average" and then say Fielder is "slightly above average". The guy has 83 home runs over the last two seasons and he's "slightly above average"?

OnWisconsin2007
09-24-2008, 01:01 AM
Yeah. Fielder should not be traded. He's putting up very solid numbers. I'd say let Hardy go way before you let Fielder go. If we make the playoffs it's on account of Prince stepping up down the stretch.

Brooke
09-24-2008, 06:36 AM
Yeah. Fielder should not be traded. He's putting up very solid numbers. I'd say let Hardy go way before you let Fielder go. If we make the playoffs it's on account of Prince stepping up down the stretch.

Yeah because giving up the best defender on the team, a guy who has been pretty much consistent at the plate all year long and the all around better player/athlete makes so much sense

OnWisconsin2007
09-24-2008, 10:17 AM
Just because you have a crush on him doesn't mean we should keep him. We have a player in the minors who's going to be better than him, flat out. Prince is a better hitter, as well. A much better hitter. Braun/Prince 3-4 is a crazy good combo.

Hermie13
09-24-2008, 10:29 AM
[QUOTE=CAIN=FUTURE;6736214]:laugh:

No way in hell the Giants trade him. Hes gonna be a stud closer. Hes like the only reliable arm in are bullpen.

:laugh2:

There's no way you get him.QUOTE]

ha, a 'stud' closer? The guy is just average. Just check out his WHIP (1.41) and ERA (4.33). Not exactly stud-like numbers if you ask me. He's got a decent enough save pct (89%) but nothing that screams star. He's got a long ways to go, and may never get there. He still may turn into a great closer...but needs to get the walks down first.

Brooke
09-24-2008, 11:33 AM
Just because you have a crush on him doesn't mean we should keep him. We have a player in the minors who's going to be better than him, flat out. Prince is a better hitter, as well. A much better hitter. Braun/Prince 3-4 is a crazy good combo.

Oh please just stop it. You dont even know me. I dont have a crush on him, just because I think JJ is a all around better player than him doesnt mean I have a crush on him and JJ is a all around better player than him whether you admit it or not!! Please dont speak for me and make assumptions. How many errors does Prince have this year??? There have been times he has choked lately. JJ and Braun have won a lot of games for this team in their last at bat

ya know I am going to stop responding to you since you always do this when people dont agree with you


I like how Hardy is flying under the radar being "very average." If he's "very average," very average is pretty damn good. I'd take a team of "very average" players in that case.

Amazing huh? Everybody is praising Prince now but when he was struggling right before he got hot I know many people were getting annoyed with him and now all of a sudden he is the best :rolleyes:

kanersen
09-24-2008, 11:59 AM
"Heyman speculation...could the Giants send Matt Cain and another player to Milwaukee for Prince Fielder, and then sign Sabathia? Or could the Rockies jump into the bidding for C.C.?"

was on mlbtraderumors.com last week

somehow i don't think giants fans will be happy with brewers coming into their forums and putting up scenarios of Cain + another quality player for Prince

Brew Crew
09-24-2008, 02:11 PM
Amazing huh? Everybody is praising Prince now but when he was struggling right before he got hot I know many people were getting annoyed with him and now all of a sudden he is the best :rolleyes:


Yeah, but the same thing happens with every player. Cubs fans do it to their guys, Philly fans do it to theirs...everyone does it. We expected so much out of him this year that it made it that much worse when he struggled.

I will only want to see Hardy stay if he moves over to 2nd or 3rd base. Shortstop needs to be opened for this kid, Alcides.

OnWisconsin2007
09-24-2008, 02:16 PM
I agree. Escobar is going to be a stud. I'd love to keep JJ at 2nd, but overall I think that Prince is a more important piece to the team.

spazzmccrory
09-24-2008, 03:02 PM
pince and hardy for cain is a horriable trade. Maybe for lincacum or however you spell it I would maybe take

SFGIANTSFAN32
09-24-2008, 03:09 PM
fielder has proven he can't put a team and his back

Fielder is also closing in on 300 lbs and could eventually break down because of that, and Cain is built like a horse and can throw 200 plus innings with ease for several years to cvome. Fielder is down from 50 plus Hr's to mid 30's

SFGIANTSFAN32
09-24-2008, 03:11 PM
:laugh:

No way in hell the Giants trade him. Hes gonna be a stud closer. Hes like the only reliable arm in are bullpen.

:laugh2:

There's no way you get him.

....Brewersfan729, how exactly are saves worthless? They're kind of the whole thing you need a closer to do.

Ya no doubt. He blew away Manny Ramirez with 100 mph fastabll just the other day in L.A.

SFGIANTSFAN32
09-24-2008, 03:15 PM
pince and hardy for cain is a horriable trade. Maybe for lincacum or however you spell it I would maybe take

You probably wouldnt get Lincecum for them two, no way. You are talking about an already Ace, 24 years old, era under 2.50, making $400,000 and could win a few cy youngs. Dont get me wrong, I would like to have Fielder and Hardy but pitching like this come around not to ofton

brewersfan729
09-24-2008, 03:58 PM
Fielder is also closing in on 300 lbs and could eventually break down because of that, and Cain is built like a horse and can throw 200 plus innings with ease for several years to cvome. Fielder is down from 50 plus Hr's to mid 30's

And Cain could blow out his arm the next time he pitches and be out for a year and then have these injuries the rest of his career. Pitchers are much more risky than hitters.

Brew Crew
09-24-2008, 04:40 PM
It's really annoying that everyone keeps using the "weight factor" on Prince. It's not like the dude got fat just this year. He's been built like that for his whole life so I'm sure he's man enough to handle it for the time being...seeing that he's only 24.

Brew Crew
09-24-2008, 04:43 PM
You probably wouldnt get Lincecum for them two, no way. You are talking about an already Ace, 24 years old, era under 2.50, making $400,000 and could win a few cy youngs. Dont get me wrong, I would like to have Fielder and Hardy but pitching like this come around not to ofton

and 50 homeruns a year doesn't come around to often. Fielder is the same age, made the same amount of money (Basically) and with pitchers these days, he's going to be making just a tiiiiiny bit more then $400,000 as well. It's not like once you're a great pitcher for a year you're automatically immune from anything bad happening whether it's injury, off year, so on...

gottaHaveHart
09-24-2008, 05:29 PM
it seems the giants fans want at least two all-stars for cain... i say lets give them two Fielder and Turn(b)low

SFGIANTSFAN32
09-24-2008, 07:59 PM
It's really annoying that everyone keeps using the "weight factor" on Prince. It's not like the dude got fat just this year. He's been built like that for his whole life so I'm sure he's man enough to handle it for the time being...seeing that he's only 24.

But being that big at 24 years old is the scary part because it will only get worse as he ages if he doesnt take care of himself, just look at his dad

OnWisconsin2007
09-24-2008, 09:03 PM
Well he changed his entire lifestyle and became a vegetarian, so it seems to me that he's committed to taking care of himself.

McNam003
09-25-2008, 07:08 AM
it seems the giants fans want at least two all-stars for cain... i say lets give them two Fielder and Turn(b)low

How about Cappy and Turnbow?

Cub_StuckinSTL
09-25-2008, 11:18 AM
Turnbow is a free agent and Cappy will probably not be offered arbitration making him a free agent also. You can't trade these guys.

Prince counts as 3 guys so trade him for Cain and Ishikawa so they are geting 3 people for two :shrug:

Brew Crew
09-25-2008, 11:51 AM
Just about every team has a guy that weighs over 250 lbs. The fat jokes aren't that funny.

Yeah seriously...How many times are we gonna hear the "Prince is the worth of 2 guys or..."Better watch out, "Prince is gonna eat him hahahahaha!"

Brew Crew
09-25-2008, 12:17 PM
Maybe he and Jeremy Jeffries just need to hang out and Prince can get some of the stuff he's smoking. You know, change up the metabolism.

gottaHaveHart
09-25-2008, 12:26 PM
Turnbow is a free agent and Cappy will probably not be offered arbitration making him a free agent also. You can't trade these guys.

i know you cant trade them... just a joke on how they want so many good players for a pitcher type that we practically have... thats all

OnWisconsin2007
09-25-2008, 05:37 PM
How many fat jokes can pathetic Cubs fans make?